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 NEW  Matt presents bias and operation data for the 6V6 tube in SE operation - 6V6 Single-Ended (SE) Ultra Linear (UL) Bias Optimization.

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PostPosted: 22 Nov 2015, 16:05 
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Joined: 21 Nov 2015, 19:52
Posts: 1
Hi all,

I'm wanting to dive into tube amp building. I'm a complete newbie to actual building. I have done some guitar pedal builds and recapped a couple of old tube radios. I'm thinking something p2p instead of pcb so I can learn how the circuit works. I'm looking for a nice high quality kit that would include everything I need so I don't have to source any parts. I figure if I get into it more then I will start sourcing my own parts. But being my first build I don't want to break the bank. I will be using it to play my mp3 and CD player through.

What would you suggest for an all inclusive kit?

Thanks in advance!


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PostPosted: 09 Aug 2016, 14:45 
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Joined: 05 Aug 2016, 14:35
Posts: 215
http://www.triodeelectronics.com/st70buildkit.html

Here is an excellent start - and using a tried and true basic amp with massive support and many modification options. You could do a lot worse. No connection with the seller, but I have used their services in the past, all good.


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PostPosted: 10 Aug 2016, 01:41 
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Joined: 29 May 2011, 12:24
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Location: Netherlands
Have a look at http://www.oddwattaudio.com as well.


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PostPosted: 10 Aug 2016, 02:31 
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Location: Chilliwack, BC
Yeah, that guy at Oddwatt has insanely good customer support, too :D

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PostPosted: 10 Aug 2016, 07:29 
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Joined: 18 Aug 2015, 07:38
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There are very few all in the kit tube builds being offered. I second Oddwatt even with a board. You will not be disappointed. Some of Matt's SE builds are a good starting point as well. No kit but few parts and part of the challenge and fun of diy is sourcing the parts. You will find plenty of help here if you just ask. My first point to point tube build was the 6EM7 amp. A very good sounding amp if you have efficient speakers. It appears that Matt may favor his later build over it right now.

http://diyaudioprojects.com/Tubes/6CY7-SET-Amplifier/

This is what I would suggest for a point to point build for a starting point. The triode electronics build is a good choice as well from all accounts. I never built it though.

http://www.triodeelectronics.com/st70buildkit.html


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PostPosted: 10 Aug 2016, 17:38 
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Joined: 04 Jun 2008, 20:59
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Location: Arizona, USA
Hi, You first need to decide what type of gear you want to build (amp, preamp, headphone amp etc) and then we can point you to some possibilities.

You thoughts raise an interesting point. I'll answer this from a manufacturing perspective. A lot of folks think that PCBs are somehow inferior to point to point wiring. I dispute that. It is true that many companies make really crappy boards and populate them with equally crappy parts. The results are pretty much what you would expect. I specify what is known as 3 ounce copper (many cheap boards use only 1 ounce ) for all traces and premium board material. When populated with quality components the end product is stable, long lasting and can properly do whatever it was intended to do. As a manufacturer I fully expect all the products I have designed to last a very long time. I even expect the tubes to last a long time (BTW all the original projects that use tubes still work to spec and still have the original tubes...some now going on 8 years). As for learning about electronics based on one type of construction vs the other...it is dubious. What is IMO important is to understand the purpose of components and how they interact. The actual schematic of a circuit is probably the best source of information on how things work. It will not tell you how to build something as there are numerous issues related to layout and construction that are not obvious. This is where questions should enter the scene. Following the description of posted projects will often fill in the necessary information.

"Insanely good customer support"....thanks, I've also be called a number of other less flattering things. One of my prime goals is to get folks interested in electronics and especially tube based audio. So whether or not you are a customer of the company or not I will take the time to inform and guide anyone who asks. It also keeps me sharp as I learn as much from questions as I do from any other source. Thus you will not only get an answer to the question or concern...but an explanation of how it works and implications of its function.

Good listening
Bruce

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PostPosted: 10 Aug 2016, 19:21 
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Joined: 06 Jun 2008, 18:23
Posts: 4834
Location: Australia
No bias but I'd be looking at an Oddwatt kit.

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PostPosted: 24 Aug 2016, 06:48 
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[quote="wdecho"]There are very few all in the kit tube builds being offered. I second Oddwatt even with a board. You will not be disappointed. Some of Matt's SE builds are a good starting point as well. No kit but few parts and part of the challenge and fun of diy is sourcing the parts. You will find plenty of help here if you just ask. My first point to point tube build was the 6EM7 amp. A very good sounding amp if you have efficient speakers. It appears that Matt may favor his later build over it right now.

http://diyaudioprojects.com/Tubes/6CY7-SET-Amplifier/

I would have a care about suggesting an SE amp as a first-build project. They are very special devices and require a certain amount of insight and managed expectations before they will be satisfying for a user. Note the following:

a) Yes, 46 Hz - 30K Hz -3 dB is not bad, but most modern amps measure bandwidth from about 4 Hz to 120K Hz +/- 3 dB or less
b) <2 wpc/rms will not drive most of the high-fidelity speakers on the market today and/or in the past in any meaningful way. Full Stop.
c) The output transformers for these devices cannot be re-purposed for other than SE amps. So, someone investing in a first-build tube amp might not want to be so-limited.

Someone just starting out as a carpenter may not want to reproduce a Chippendale chair as a first project. Let the OP get a few more conventional builds under his belt before moving on to Exotica. Now, of course, the natural outcome of an SE amp is the building of specialized speakers for it .... all good.


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PostPosted: 24 Aug 2016, 08:06 
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Joined: 20 Feb 2014, 10:35
Posts: 45
Location: NZ
wdecho wrote:
There are very few all in the kit tube builds being offered.


On the contrary, there are actually several tube kit makers, I can think of half a dozen off the top of my head.
Anyway, no-one notice the date of the OP's question? - poor fellow has probably lost interest by now.


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PostPosted: 24 Aug 2016, 12:27 
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Joined: 07 Dec 2015, 14:21
Posts: 135
Peter W. wrote:
wdecho wrote:
There are very few all in the kit tube builds being offered. I second Oddwatt even with a board. You will not be disappointed. Some of Matt's SE builds are a good starting point as well. No kit but few parts and part of the challenge and fun of diy is sourcing the parts. You will find plenty of help here if you just ask. My first point to point tube build was the 6EM7 amp. A very good sounding amp if you have efficient speakers. It appears that Matt may favor his later build over it right now.

http://diyaudioprojects.com/Tubes/6CY7-SET-Amplifier/

I would have a care about suggesting an SE amp as a first-build project. They are very special devices and require a certain amount of insight and managed expectations before they will be satisfying for a user. Note the following:

a) Yes, 46 Hz - 30K Hz -3 dB is not bad, but most modern amps measure bandwidth from about 4 Hz to 120K Hz +/- 3 dB or less
b) <2 wpc/rms will not drive most of the high-fidelity speakers on the market today and/or in the past in any meaningful way. Full Stop.
c) The output transformers for these devices cannot be re-purposed for other than SE amps. So, someone investing in a first-build tube amp might not want to be so-limited.

Someone just starting out as a carpenter may not want to reproduce a Chippendale chair as a first project. Let the OP get a few more conventional builds under his belt before moving on to Exotica. Now, of course, the natural outcome of an SE amp is the building of specialized speakers for it .... all good.



Good points. :up:

When making the decision to go SET amplification one needs to have the right speakers for the job. Heck I consider myself fairly experienced and I had to really make my mind up on building one, it was only when some very efficient fully horn loaded speakers fell on my lap was when I decided yes 5wpc of SET amplification is plenty, but again very few people have 105db @ 1watt/1meter efficient speakers. Also you bet your @ss that if I have a 2 watt amp it better be flat down to at least 20Hz, I mean it's only 2 watts here so the transformers aren't going to be huge. The flip side is if the person understands these things and wants to dive in I think a single ended tube amp is a simple endeavour so long as you pick a good circuit and spring for good output iron it will be very rewarding. I see so many people build these amps and cheap out on the most important part of the whole thing, the output transformer. I think a lot of people are bi-amping with these 2 watt tube amps, tubes on top and SS on bottom, big expensive output transformers aren't needed for this method. I find I never flip on my sub for music so I am happy with the low end from my amp, of course it helps when you use a tube that has an rp~400 and combine it with adequate OPT, it eats 300b's for breakfast :thumbsup:


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